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Author Topic: Waltz 1-3 natural turn  (Read 3826 times)
Dora-Satya Veda
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« Reply #15 on: October 10, 2009, 04:46:17 PM »

Right on.  I just wasted $gzillion on a useless step Shocked Grin

I wouldn't call it a useless step. It is just not a step used that often. I do know they say first impression lasts but why only do that first impression once. I am sorry as you said on another thread, I am really lazy and do like to be as efficient as absolutely possible.

I do think it would be better to work on rules and principles. The rules and principles can then be applied to each of the steps you dance, rather then working on one step that is not used that often.

Just my 2 cents worth!

DSV
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"As we understand more things, everthing is becoming simpler"

Edward Teller
cdnsalsanut
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« Reply #16 on: October 10, 2009, 05:22:58 PM »

AN interesting subject. 

One of my teachers said something once that stays with me. Which isn't too much a stretch because I haven't been dancing that long, but we were talking about competing a level up, in silver, using bronze steps. He said:

On the social dance floor, you see people dancing championship steps like beginners. In competition you can see people dancing beginner steps like champions.  At Blackpool you see champions dancing basic steps, but beautifully.  Some steps you may not even recognize as bronze steps, they are so beautifully executed. 

So, you can dance advanced steps like a beginner, or you can dance basic steps like a champion.

I will never forget that.  As discussed, in waltz most people start with a natural turn, yet so few people execute it beautifully. You can almost see the level of the dancers by how they begin with these basic steps.

And yet the natural turn and other basic steps have taught us to understand some very advanced ideas: Swing and sway, drag, compression. I've been dancing a year and a half now and we're still working on frame and basic steps and ideas and I'm fine with that.  I think our dancing is improving steadily as a result.
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"There are short-cuts to happiness, and dancing is one of them."
~Vicki Baum
Dora-Satya Veda
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« Reply #17 on: October 10, 2009, 05:49:47 PM »

 
One of my teachers said something once that stays with me. Which isn't too much a stretch because I haven't been dancing that long, but we were talking about competing a level up, in silver, using bronze steps. He said:

On the social dance floor, you see people dancing championship steps like beginners. In competition you can see people dancing beginner steps like champions.  At Blackpool you see champions dancing basic steps, but beautifully.  Some steps you may not even recognize as bronze steps, they are so beautifully executed. 

So, you can dance advanced steps like a beginner, or you can dance basic steps like a champion.

Very well said and have to totally agree with this.

Quote
As discussed, in waltz most people start with a natural turn, yet so few people execute it beautifully. You can almost see the level of the dancers by how they begin with these basic steps.

Yes, I would agree with this too. When judging seeing the first three steps will often places the couple without looking any further. If you want to do well in competitions then one should think it is about putting you best foot forward so to speak. If you are not able to dance the 1-3 of Natural Turn from a Preparation Step as you are able to do it later in flight, then why start with it?

Quote
And yet the natural turn and other basic steps have taught us to understand some very advanced ideas.

Yes, I agree. We should dance basic steps or “golden routines” to learn the basic rules and principles. If you can’t do the basic rules and principles in basic steps then you will never be able to do them. I am not bashing basic steps. What I am saying is….it would be a good idea to understand the movement of the basic steps. There are steps the slow down, speed up, staying still, flight steps, none flight steps and more. I am saying use the steps to help you promote the effect that you are trying to get. If you are trying to move then don’t do a stopped step right after and the other way around. Find the essence of the steps and then put them together in a way that helps dancing each step to its fullest.

It takes a lot of skill to get full body flight and full swing doing 1-3 of a Natural Turn from a Preparation Step. Don’t sell yourself short because you don’t think there are any other options. Do show what you are really capable of by giving a good first impression.

DSV
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"As we understand more things, everthing is becoming simpler"

Edward Teller
TangoDancer
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« Reply #18 on: October 11, 2009, 05:58:46 AM »

Enjoying the thread. Not adding much b/c it is well covered, and I agree. Let's keep going.
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The most beautiful part of the dance is often found in between the steps... and in the movement within the stillness.
elisedance
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ee


« Reply #19 on: October 11, 2009, 06:38:32 AM »

.......

It takes a lot of skill to get full body flight and full swing doing 1-3 of a Natural Turn from a Preparation Step. Don’t sell yourself short because you don’t think there are any other options. Do show what you are really capable of by giving a good first impression.


Is this the general point then? Work on the aspects of dancing that will advance you the most - but compete only with those that you are best at.

With that thinking, the Waltz 1-3 Natural turn is a terrific training step but a dangerous competition one Smiley
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SwingWaltz
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« Reply #20 on: October 11, 2009, 08:26:47 AM »

Well I've been told that at this particular comp we had 3 adjudicators looking at us when we started our routine (prep step, half natural), but as soon as we finished our half natural, they looked away.
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cdnsalsanut
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« Reply #21 on: October 11, 2009, 08:31:33 AM »

I am very interested in learning more about these "golden routines" .  Any chance of you sharing them with us or pointing me in the right direction?  Much appreciated...
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Dora-Satya Veda
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« Reply #22 on: October 11, 2009, 12:50:59 PM »

.......

It takes a lot of skill to get full body flight and full swing doing 1-3 of a Natural Turn from a Preparation Step. Don’t sell yourself short because you don’t think there are any other options. Do show what you are really capable of by giving a good first impression.


Is this the general point then? Work on the aspects of dancing that will advance you the most - but compete only with those that you are best at.

With that thinking, the Waltz 1-3 Natural turn is a terrific training step but a dangerous competition one Smiley


If you want to look your best and want good results then I would say "yes". If you don't care about result but you want to dance all the stuff you are not good at then by all means do that. You will look bad but if that is what you see as having fun then that is what you should do.
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"As we understand more things, everthing is becoming simpler"

Edward Teller
Dora-Satya Veda
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« Reply #23 on: October 11, 2009, 12:57:44 PM »

I am very interested in learning more about these "golden routines" .  Any chance of you sharing them with us or pointing me in the right direction?  Much appreciated...

Each School of Thought has their own "golden routines". You will have to find out which School of Thought you follow and then ask for the "golden routines" that they use.

There are not many Body School of Thought followers in Canada....if any at all. It could mess you up more then help you if you were to follow somebody else’s "golden routine".

So check with you coach/teacher and ask them for the “golden routines”.

DSV
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"As we understand more things, everthing is becoming simpler"

Edward Teller
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« Reply #24 on: October 13, 2009, 04:11:40 AM »

Is this the general point then? Work on the aspects of dancing that will advance you the most - but compete only with those that you are best at.

I believe that you really do not see that you have all of these answers already. !-3 of the natural will give one everything necessary in order to dance a good waltz. I believe what DSV is saying is that one should definitely study it, and study it to death for the reason just mentioned. However, do not be bogged down with it when dancing. The tech/movement that one learns with this step is carried through to all/most of the others. Re your reply... this step cintains the aspects that will advance you, but if you are unable to apply it to other movemnts, then you are, pardon the pun, dancing backwards.
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The most beautiful part of the dance is often found in between the steps... and in the movement within the stillness.
TangoDancer
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« Reply #25 on: October 13, 2009, 04:15:02 AM »

Well I've been told that at this particular comp we had 3 adjudicators looking at us when we started our routine (prep step, half natural), but as soon as we finished our half natural, they looked away.

A more important point is not what they did, but why. Adjudicating, often I see a couple begin with this movment, and I look away for something more interesting. Other times, I see a couple begin with this movement, and know that they have mastered the art of body flight through the proper time/space, and need not see more.

What should you do?   Hmmmm......  Roll Eyes    Smiley
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The most beautiful part of the dance is often found in between the steps... and in the movement within the stillness.
elisedance
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ee


« Reply #26 on: October 13, 2009, 06:48:34 AM »

What should you do?   Hmmmm......  Roll Eyes    Smiley

Simple - dance the Waltz 1-3 natural turn - perfectly Cheesy
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If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
SwingWaltz
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« Reply #27 on: October 13, 2009, 09:20:48 AM »

Well I've been told that at this particular comp we had 3 adjudicators looking at us when we started our routine (prep step, half natural), but as soon as we finished our half natural, they looked away.

A more important point is not what they did, but why. Adjudicating, often I see a couple begin with this movment, and I look away for something more interesting. Other times, I see a couple begin with this movement, and know that they have mastered the art of body flight through the proper time/space, and need not see more.

What should you do?   Hmmmm......  Roll Eyes    Smiley

Um...cause we screwed up... Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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ZPomeroy
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Victoria, Australia


« Reply #28 on: November 08, 2009, 01:57:48 AM »

I have a question for you all: do you prefer the 1 - 3 of a natural turn to be in a continuous type fashion whereby it is hard to distinguish between the end of the 1 - 3 of a natural turn and the start of a spin turn, or do you prefer to see them seperated. I know this is a question based upon stylistic interpretation, but i only came across this idea of continuity through these steps over the last week and wanted to see how popular this styling is.

Zac
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TangoDancer
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« Reply #29 on: November 08, 2009, 04:12:42 AM »

I have a question for you all: do you prefer the 1 - 3 of a natural turn to be in a continuous type fashion whereby it is hard to distinguish between the end of the 1 - 3 of a natural turn and the start of a spin turn, or do you prefer to see them seperated. I know this is a question based upon stylistic interpretation, but i only came across this idea of continuity through these steps over the last week and wanted to see how popular this styling is.

Zac

If I am understanding correctly, there should be some sense of both in a natural waltz movement, regardless, yes? One should not rush the succeeding walk from the rise w/o properly executing the lower. Yet, one should neither stop the movement at the lower, thus disconnecting the succeeding step, and interrupting the natural/desired float of the dance.     Huh
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The most beautiful part of the dance is often found in between the steps... and in the movement within the stillness.
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