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Author Topic: Things you wish instructors would emphasize sooner  (Read 13069 times)
samina
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« Reply #90 on: October 31, 2009, 06:47:01 PM »

I'm not disagreeing with you. . . .

The amusing bit is the way I teach the novices at ballroom - pure Argentine Tango, and the rest West Coast Swiing.. . .none of the ballroom garbage.





well...yes... you are disagreeing. you're calling it "ballroom garbage"... not "garbage". you have made an association between the two and are assuming it is a correct one.
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QPO
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Adelaide South Australia


« Reply #91 on: October 31, 2009, 10:44:07 PM »

I hope the discussions stays on focus.....There are strengths and weaknesses in each style and they are different. As much as I am still new at competing and have issues with timing and actually following rather than anticipating.

Each style has its place...I love ballroom and find it a great Challenge and AT was very enjoyable, I found the music  a challenge (It was all the same)  but that may have been more the providers choice.

We all learn differently and have to find the teacher that can bring us to the outcome we are aspiring to.

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elisedance
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« Reply #92 on: November 01, 2009, 01:40:29 AM »

we do ballroom 'garbage' all the time - and though the man may decide on the step thats about the only decision he makes alone.  Read some of DSV's posts on the subject - the man provides steps and power, the woman turns these into motions and the man listens.

Thats what I meant - dig a bit deeper into PDO and you might just learn something - to summerize: that ballroom is like any other partner dance, a movement conversation between two people...
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The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
albanaich
Intermediate Bronze

Posts: 236


« Reply #93 on: November 01, 2009, 02:28:24 PM »

Well Samina when I say 'Ballroom garbage' I meant the way you had so much difficulty with and which you were so unimpressed with. I'm only an a 'helping hand' not teacher, but getting them to focus on what foot I am on and what foot they are on (Argentine Tango)  seems to work much better than forward side together, back side together etc.

Once you get them moving freely, they do need to know steps, they just follow your lead - its a completely backwards approach to the way I've been taught in every ballroom class.

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samina
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« Reply #94 on: November 01, 2009, 02:56:42 PM »

Well Samina when I say 'Ballroom garbage' I meant the way you had so much difficulty with and which you were so unimpressed with. I'm only an a 'helping hand' not teacher, but getting them to focus on what foot I am on and what foot they are on (Argentine Tango)  seems to work much better than forward side together, back side together etc.

Once you get them moving freely, they do need to know steps, they just follow your lead - its a completely backwards approach to the way I've been taught in every ballroom class.



I didn't have difficulty with it and I wasn't unimpressed by it. I have nothing negative to say about that first year or so with my instructor whatsoever. And it was hardly a typical experience for a ballroom student -- it was an intense & massive download of high-level information, which I had asked for. *However*... it was when we shifted to a different approach (when I was ready for it, I might add) that I experienced rapid on-the-floor progress.

People require different approaches based on what they are ready for, based on what they want, on their personalities, on their limitations. It sounds like you are promoting a one-size-fits-all, black-and-white approach to teaching & learning, which -- based on the fact that people are so different -- doesn't seem realistic to me.
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Ginger
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I see what you did there.


« Reply #95 on: November 01, 2009, 03:14:08 PM »

*clompclompclompclomp*

TROOOOLLLLL!!!!

IN THE DUNGEOONNNN!!!

Thought you oughter know...

*faint*
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albanaich
Intermediate Bronze

Posts: 236


« Reply #96 on: November 01, 2009, 03:25:46 PM »

Thank you for your very informative and considered post Ginger. .. . . .
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albanaich
Intermediate Bronze

Posts: 236


« Reply #97 on: November 01, 2009, 03:33:04 PM »

Dancesport is not like the other partner dances - it is almost entirely lacking in musical interpretion, which to the other partner dances is what actually constitutes dancing.

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samina
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« Reply #98 on: November 01, 2009, 03:43:44 PM »

Alba, your pronouncements are so emphatic, there's really nothing to say to them -- you don't dialogue, you just proclaim. So of course, you aren't going to find the most cooperative audience. You have to be cooperative on your part, as well.

One thing... if you are, as you imply, a dancer's dancer, then you probably desire to improve in any way you can. And one thing I know to be true... as a dancer, you cannot disassociate who you are from how you dance.

Partner dancing requires listening carefully, from both sides... and flexibility. Adaptability. Adjustment. The willingness to leave one's ego at the door and give up many assumptions.

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albanaich
Intermediate Bronze

Posts: 236


« Reply #99 on: November 01, 2009, 05:00:03 PM »

I don't do consensus - which is not the same as not doing dialogue.

You are welcome to challenge anything I post, as long as what you have to say is based on fact and evidence.  I am not interested in your or the groups approval.

The nature of my work means I am constantly travellling and I take my dancing where I can get it in what forms are available. I think mysef lucky if I get to spend 6 months in one place.

What this means is that I get to experience a very, very varied dance environments and teaching techniques as a result you get very clear picture of what dance is in terms of a general overview.

I've been working as a 'lead dummy' for the last 5 weeks, and its been fascinating. My job is basically to drag complete novices on the floor and give them the confidence to pursue ballroom (yes ballroom) as an interest. It's amazing how much you can teach someone in an hour. (and I do 4 hours a week).Teachers make it SO complicated, when its not.

Cha Cha Cha is 1 - 2 triple, Jive is 1 -2 -triple triple, Rumba 1-2 1-2 Waltz  1-2-3 1-2-3, this is not rocket science. Then you teach them to listen to what foot you are on, usually by rocking to the beat and walking with them (Argentine Tango)

You dance the Waltz with them making them call out the time as you dance 1 -2 -3, you tell them that you may go forwards, backwards, sideways all they have to do is concentrate on what foot I'm standing on.  They count, they learn to change wieght as they count, you know what foot is free, you can put them more or less anywhere. It's that simple.

No sequences, no steps, you just keep pushing them, throw in a chasse, then a spin, then a whisk - and they just go where you put them. What's complicated about it?









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elisedance
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« Reply #100 on: November 01, 2009, 05:34:20 PM »

I don't do consensus - which is not the same as not doing dialogue.
You mean you are averse to consensus?  So if we all agreed with you you would go away?

You are welcome to challenge anything I post, as long as what you have to say is based on fact and evidence.  I am not interested in your or the groups approval.
Sorry, but you don't set rules for communication.  People will respond to you as they see fit - the difference is that they will almost all be polite.
If you are not prepared to do the same your tenure on the forum will be short.  We are not afraid of radical thoughts or ideas - its by dealing with such that we learn and grow.  However, we will not tolerate disrespect and boorishness.  That undermines the purpose of PDO - it is a haven from the disrespectful and rude. 

Get this: other than the truly offensive (racist etc) its not your ideas but your treatment of others that will get you banned from this forum.

If you are not interested in the groups approval why should the group be interested in your offerings?  If I may translate for you: "I will say what I want and I don't care what you say in reply".  That is not discourse but dictate.  That is not communication but lecture.  That sort of writing belongs on a blog not on a forum.  The purpose of a forum is to discuss and the purpose of discussion is to be open to other people's ideas - that is to be willing to change your own.  Every active member of this forum respects and welcomes these principles. 

What this means is that I get to experience a very, very varied dance environments and teaching techniques as a result you get very clear picture of what dance is in terms of a general overview.
And if thats where you stopped it would be OK.  but your implication is very strong that somehow you know more about the subject than anyone else.  Nowhere in anything you have written have I seen any capacity to listen and learn.  I don't care if you danced and taught in every studio in the world - you could still learn something from the most naive dancer .  The sad part is that you have now alienated the most knowledgeable people on the forum and have been closed off from information.

Perhaps that is why you suffer the delusion that you are all- knowing - because you set yourself up in such a way as to cut off the very information you need the most - and voila!  There is nothing new to learn. Undecided
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If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
pruthe
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Posts: 274



« Reply #101 on: November 01, 2009, 05:37:13 PM »

Do not feed the trolls (DNFTT).
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"It's not what you do, but how you do it."

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albanaich
Intermediate Bronze

Posts: 236


« Reply #102 on: November 01, 2009, 05:43:56 PM »

Deleted - off topic post
« Last Edit: November 02, 2009, 02:44:15 AM by elisedance » Logged
albanaich
Intermediate Bronze

Posts: 236


« Reply #103 on: November 01, 2009, 06:44:42 PM »

deleted

this subject was moved to a new topic just for you AB and you were asked to not continue it here

If you can not follow the simple rules of the forum you will no longer be welcome here.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2009, 08:30:57 PM by elisedance » Logged
Lioness
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« Reply #104 on: November 01, 2009, 06:53:46 PM »

I don't particularly want you to agree with me, its more important to me that you are aware of the facts. Get it? The facts.

Excuse me? The facts? You've done a conclusive and unbiased scientific study on this have you? What right do you have to claim that your opinion, though perhaps shared by others, is fact?

Quote from: albaniach
The fact is we have yet to find a ballroom dancer able to distinquish between dancing to the music and not dancing to music, it follows from that that ballroom dancers have no understanding of musicality.

You've looked at every single ballroom dancer? No? Then you have no right to draw such conclusions



I have no problem with you opinion. I am not defending ballroom dancers because I don't like what you've said. I defend because I strongly dislike your tone of posting, and your assumpting that your opinion is law
« Last Edit: November 01, 2009, 06:56:50 PM by Lioness » Logged
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