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| | | |-+  So (in your opinion) What makes a good/great student?
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Author Topic: So (in your opinion) What makes a good/great student?  (Read 1566 times)
emeralddancer
Intermediate Gold
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Posts: 2979

Nottingham, MD (by way of NJ)


« on: July 31, 2009, 11:33:19 AM »

We always ask about a good pro/coach/mentor/teacher  etc ...

But WHAT makes a good/great student for the teacher? ( I guess this could almost piggy back on the qualities of a "star", but this is a bit different)

Like what would your dream pupil(s) be?

Would love to hear from the teachers/coaches and see what is in their brains on this.
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It is more important who they are as people and only then is it important who they are as dancers.~Marcia Haydee
Ginger
Bronze
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Posts: 497

I see what you did there.


« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2009, 03:15:42 PM »

I'm not the primary coach/teacher, but I'm often the prop/follow example, so this is just my perspective.

We enjoy people who have fun with it most of all. People who like to be there, and keep trying and even laughing, until they render an approximation thereof.

People who don't willfully block out what you're trying to say because "You're Not So-and-so, so I don't have to listen".

Asking intelligent questions, instead of questions just to make you think they think they know what they're doing (you've seen these guys in class- akin to hecklers).

The ones who arrive punctually, prepared, and ready to go.

Things I personally don't like:

People who prolong their "oops, teehee, I goofed up" moments. Yay, you screwed up, it's okay, now get back here.

People who ask you "How do I do this"- then DEMAND "No- show me this"... and then contradict everything you say with "But that's not how she showed me"... when I'm parroting VERBATIM what I SAW HER SAY TO HIM.

People who WANT all the help and attention in the world... just so they can blow it off.

We had a couple really good students up north, but the've disappeared since it's fishing/auto racing season Sad I miss them.
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dream a little dream
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Posts: 1837


« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2009, 04:47:00 PM »

If you asked my former pro, I'm sure he would say I am as far from a good/great student as he could think!
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MusicChica
Intermediate Silver
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Posts: 1325


« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2009, 05:22:23 PM »

That would be why he's your FORMER pro. Undecided

Same for one of mine, FWIW.
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Dora-Satya Veda
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Posts: 6871


« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2009, 06:57:27 PM »

That is a big question. A good student can mean many things. My teacher talked about the “prize students” and the students that he enjoyed teaching as being two totally different kinds of students. He actually said that it was very seldom the same students. He used to say that “prize students” are often a pain in the “asset” and the students that he enjoyed often didn’t go that far in major competitions. I have to agree with him. I have had many “prize students” but only a few “prize students” that I also enjoyed teaching. They sure are far and few in between.

So my question to you is what you mean by a good student?

Do you mean a “prize student” or do you mean enjoying teaching the student or both?

A “prize student’ is good to have, if you are trying to develop a name for yourself as a teacher/coach. A “prize student” wins or is at least in finals in most competitions entered. You often have to convince them about everything that you want them to do. You have to show them that you are able to do it. They often complain about not making leaps of improvements. Their mistakes are often very small and the corrections are often small. They are picky, moody and often very sensitive.

A student that is enjoyable is often a student that you can have a sensible and constructive dance discussion with. This student has left the ultra-ego and present emotions at the door and is open and willing to do what you tell them to do without judgment. They respect you for what you say and what you have done. You look forward to days where these students are booked. Most “prize students” start like this and then turn into monsters as they start getting successful.

As I said before I have been fortunate enough to have a few students that were enjoyable “prize students”. I have over the years become more careful who I take under my wings. I am not ready to take a “prize student” that is not enjoyable to teach under my wings any more. They are just too much work. It is easy to create a “prize student” but the cost from the teacher’s/coach’s side in regards to time and energy is just too much to do, if there is no passion in it. At least I think the price is too high, if there is not passion driving the effort.

I am not sure if this is what you were looking for. If not then keep asking and I am sure I will be able to clarify it better.

Dora-Satya Veda

Sorry, here I go again.........writting a book. Tongue
« Last Edit: October 03, 2009, 02:12:03 PM by elisedance » Logged

"As we understand more things, everthing is becoming simpler"

Edward Teller
emeralddancer
Intermediate Gold
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Posts: 2979

Nottingham, MD (by way of NJ)


« Reply #5 on: August 01, 2009, 03:49:38 PM »

I meant both.

write a book, stop apologizing we LOVE your posts.

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It is more important who they are as people and only then is it important who they are as dancers.~Marcia Haydee
skipper
Bronze
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Posts: 376


« Reply #6 on: August 01, 2009, 08:16:24 PM »

Yes---PLEASE WRTE A BOOK!!!!

What about all the people out there that should at least have a chance to hear this information? They may agree or disagree, but isn't that their choice?
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QPO
reg mods
Continental Champion
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Posts: 20824


Adelaide South Australia


« Reply #7 on: August 02, 2009, 01:48:26 AM »

yes I agree. you should write a book about your experiences (if you have not done so already) both from the dancing career side and the teaching side...I for one will buy a copy... Grin
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Dance Forum
ttd
Open Bronze
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Posts: 642


« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2009, 10:16:48 PM »

People who like to be there...

I know this one guy, he used to work as a personal trainer at the gym, but switched to physical therapy at the hospital. He told me that pay & benefits were better at the hospital, but he liked his gym clients better because they were there because they chose to, while his clients at physical therapy were there because they had to, so their attitude was different.
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MusicChica
Intermediate Silver
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Posts: 1325


« Reply #9 on: August 10, 2009, 10:50:49 PM »

I can believe that.  People go to the gym because they want to get healthy, but they think of physical therapy as a chore prescribed by their doctor.
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elisedance
Administrator
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ee


« Reply #10 on: October 03, 2009, 05:16:38 AM »

That is a big question. A good student can mean many things. My teacher talked about the “price students” and the students that he enjoyed teaching as being two totally different kinds of students. He actually said that it was very seldom the same students. He used to say that “price students” are often a pain in the “asset” and the students that he enjoyed often didn’t go that far in major competitions. I have to agree with him. I have had many “price students” but only a few “price students” that I also enjoyed teaching. They sure are far and few in between.

So my question to you is what you mean by a good student?

Do you mean a “price student” or do you mean enjoying teaching the student or both?

A “price student’ is good to have, if you are trying to develop a name for yourself as a teacher/coach. A “price student” wins or is at least in finals in most competitions entered. You often have to convince them about everything that you want them to do. You have to show them that you are able to do it. They often complain about not making leaps of improvements. Their mistakes are often very small and the corrections are often small. They are picky, moody and often very sensitive.

A student that is enjoyable is often a student that you can have a sensible and constructive dance discussion with. This student has left the ultra-ego and present emotions at the door and is open and willing to do what you tell them to do without judgment. They respect you for what you say and what you have done. You look forward to days where these students are booked. Most “price students” start like this and then turn into monsters as they start getting successful.

As I said before I have been fortunate enough to have a few students that were enjoyable “price students”. I have over the years become more careful who I take under my wings. I am not ready to take a “price student” that is not enjoyable to teach under my wings any more. They are just too much work. It is easy to create a “price student” but the cost from the teacher’s/coach’s side in regards to time and energy is just too much to do, if there is no passion in it. At least I think the price is too high, if there is not passion driving the effort.

I am not sure if this is what you were looking for. If not then keep asking and I am sure I will be able to clarify it better.

Dora-Satya Veda

Sorry, here I go again.........writting a book. Tongue

Re read this DSV - did you perhaps mean 'prize' (star) students?  Thats quite different from 'price' (cost) Wink

Does this apply mostly to the young, career-track students doesn't it?  Would you characterize the older ones the same way?  Also, the way I read the above it sounds like you would prefer to teach interested, invested and non-ambitious students over ones that want to win a national or world championship.  Is that really the case?
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If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
Dora-Satya Veda
Gold Star
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Posts: 6871


« Reply #11 on: October 03, 2009, 02:05:18 PM »

Re read this DSV - did you perhaps mean 'prize' (star) students?  Thats quite different from 'price' (cost)

I was trying to go back and modify this but I am not able to. I really like the idea of being able to go back. to correct spelling and clarify point that was clear the first time around.

I meant "Prize" student. It basically a student that bring honors to the teacher in some form or another!

Quote
Does this apply mostly to the young, career-track students doesn't it?  Would you characterize the older ones the same way? 

Not necessarily, I had a “prize” student that was in his 60’s but he became a prize student because he changed his dancing so fast that he became the talk of the studio. A “prize” student is a student that causes the teacher to be seen in a great light by others. The student basically makes the teacher shine.

Quote
Also, the way I read the above it sounds like you would prefer to teach interested, invested and non-ambitious students over ones that want to win a national or world championship.  Is that really the case?

Every teacher/coach is in a different place or on a different path with their career so I can’t speak for every teacher/coach. I have been fortunate to have student of all levels. Because of this I have become very picky whom I take in as a child. It is a lot a work to take somebody all the way from infancy to adulthood. I have found that “prize” student are often more work then what I am willing to do nowadays. They need you 24 hour a day. They are not like an adult but rather like an infant. You basically feed them, cloth them, discipline them and love them not matter what. Then they get into their “teens” and they often get outright rude and show very little gratitude for all your work.  It is like being on “Space Mountain”. They take you on a roller coaster ride and you have no idea where they are going and when they are going. There is often a lot of drama and politics involved when you are involved with couples that want to win nationals or worlds. Hopefully they stay around long enough to reach adulthood (retirement) and that is when you experience the joy of having seen them grow up and become a “prize”.

I personally am beginning to like the role as grandmother more and more. I can send the child/ren back to their parent, when they don’t behave.

There are some teacher/coaches that enjoy and even live for the ride whereas others don’t. I am at a point in my life where I don’t mind a few rides but I don’t want to be on a constant ride anymore. So today I have students of all levels and I enjoy every one of them. I took the time to find out what I really liked to do and today that is what I am doing. I like variety and that is what I have today.  Grin
 
DSV
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"As we understand more things, everthing is becoming simpler"

Edward Teller
elisedance
Administrator
Blackpool Finalist
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Posts: 35013


ee


« Reply #12 on: October 03, 2009, 02:09:13 PM »

I was trying to go back and modify this but I am not able to. I really like the idea of being able to go back. to correct spelling and clarify point that was clear the first time around.


I'm not sure what to do.  Some PDO members have gone deleted their older posts reducing the topics to jibberish.  We either put up with that everyone can edit their posts or we put a limit on the time that you can edit.  Right now we are experimenting with the latter but I wish we did not have to.

I will, however, go back and edit that word for you.
e
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If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
Dora-Satya Veda
Gold Star
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Posts: 6871


« Reply #13 on: October 03, 2009, 02:14:22 PM »

I was trying to go back and modify this but I am not able to. I really like the idea of being able to go back. to correct spelling and clarify point that was clear the first time around.


I'm not sure what to do.  Some PDO members have gone deleted their older posts reducing the topics to jibberish.  We either put up with that everyone can edit their posts or we put a limit on the time that you can edit.  Right now we are experimenting with the latter but I wish we did not have to.

I will, however, go back and edit that word for you.
e

Thank you, I am not trying to delete anything at all. I just like to correct and clarify. I do understand your predicament though.

I will just have to have you be my spell check then. Wink
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"As we understand more things, everthing is becoming simpler"

Edward Teller
elisedance
Administrator
Blackpool Finalist
*****
Posts: 35013


ee


« Reply #14 on: October 03, 2009, 02:30:37 PM »

what we may is make editing a privilidge not a right.....
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If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
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