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Author Topic: Rating your Pro - part B: ranking the factors  (Read 1653 times)
elisedance
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« on: June 24, 2009, 11:01:55 PM »

So.  Here are the list of traits that we are planning to rank our pros with. 
1. Achievements (championships/cred in your form of dancing)
2. Availability (
3. Book knowledge (training in fundamentals of dance)
4. Price per lesson (cheap/expensive)
5. Personality
6. Generosity
7. Punctuality
8. Reliability (does not cancel lessons on the day of unless it's an emergency)
9. Compatibility (do you and your pro get along?)
10. Focus
11. Ability to see small mistakes
12. Ability to make the lesson fun
13. Ability to make complex principles simple to do
14. Ability to understand and explain principles from other "schools of thought"
15. Ability to see the big picture (the entire presentation of the dance)
16. Ability to choreograph routines that are both entertaining and highlights the student's strengths (comp or showcase).
17. Showmanship (for showcases)
 

We need to some idea of their order of importance.  Anyone want to try ( a few different rankings would be a good idea).  Copy the list above and put them in whatever order you prefer from highest importance first to lowest...
« Last Edit: June 25, 2009, 04:07:43 PM by elisedance » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: June 25, 2009, 01:40:48 PM »

Wouldn't ranking these really depend on what you want to get out of taking dance lessons?

Regardless of what your goals are, I think that Compatibility and ability to make the lesson fun would be top criteria.  If you don't get along with your pro and the lessons aren't fun, then how could you continue?
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elisedance
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« Reply #2 on: June 25, 2009, 03:33:05 PM »

because some coaches are outstanding and also obnoxious... it depends, as you say, on your goals.

Imagine if you wanted to be a world champion and the one coach that seemed to reliably put people there was also an obnoxious, selfish, cocaine adict... well, if thats your goal...

I think this actually happens to some extend everywhere.  Indeed, the better the coaches the more they can be anyway they want - so the more likely you will get, shall we say personality factors, coming out...
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Dora-Satya Veda
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« Reply #3 on: June 25, 2009, 04:07:03 PM »

Imagine if you wanted to be a world champion and the one coach that seemed to reliably put people there was also an obnoxious, selfish, cocaine adict... well, if thats your goal...

I think this actually happens to some extend everywhere.  Indeed, the better the coaches the more they can be anyway they want - so the more likely you will get, shall we say personality factors, coming out...

I would say that some (many) of the "old" greats were very obnoxious, selfish, smoking in your face, wandering hands and liked the bottle a little too much. They did create world champions and were a wealth of knowledge. They were all characters, eccentric and had very strong personalities. They were not trying to fit in. They were being themselves. I loved my lessons with them though. They were all a lot of fun and interesting to work with. I would want to have missed any of them. They all helped shape my mind and dancing. I wouldn't be where I am today without them being such a big part of my life. I will be forever grateful to them for their generosity with knowledge and the laughs we had together. They all have a very special place in my heart.

Dora-Satya Veda
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elisedance
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« Reply #4 on: June 25, 2009, 04:08:08 PM »

[I just updated the list above with a few more ideas]
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« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2009, 04:09:04 PM »

Well, then, it depends on how much you want to sacrifice to get where you want to be.  
Right now, unless someone I respect tells me that I have the ability to be a world champion, I want an instructor who makes things fun and who I can get along with.  If I don't like him and I work with him on a weekly or daily basis, I won't work as hard as if I do like my instructor.  Likewise, if every lesson is a horrible experience and I don't feel as though I am getting better, than why bother?
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catsmeow
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« Reply #6 on: June 25, 2009, 10:45:43 PM »

we should ask the others how much abuse they would take if it meant getting better
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Rugby
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« Reply #7 on: June 25, 2009, 11:09:21 PM »

I had a few riding instructors that were military men and ran the lessons like we were their army troops.  Screaming, red to purple faces, and cracking whips were all part of the lesson.  Most people left but those that stayed did so because they knew that what was to be gained far outweighed having to put up with the abrasive teaching style.

One of our dance instructors was very abrasive but we learned a great deal from him until he moved on.
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elisedance
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« Reply #8 on: June 26, 2009, 02:48:27 AM »

I think I can guess who.... lets see, west coast?
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emeralddancer
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« Reply #9 on: June 26, 2009, 12:46:36 PM »

1. Achievements - My instruct has had a few. His highest was placing 2nd Rising Star Prof Standard at 2006 St. Louis Star Ball
2. Availability - Always available
3. Book knowledge - Book and Practical knowledge is top notch. His knowledge is incredible and his practical, like physically dancing ...if he stuck with it he would have been a champion. Great frame, technique, work ethic, showmanship, etc ...
4. Price per lesson - I can afford him  Grin and since I am in a studio with champions that are in demand, it helps.
5. Personality - I like it, a good mix of fun but since he knows I am serious about competing ...well that has changed drastically. Thankfully I can handle it. He is very caring, kind, compassionate. He can turn it on/off quickly when necessary. LOL
6. Generosity - very
7. Punctuality - always with/in 5mins give or take
8. Reliability
- we struggle with this ...but there are outside factors involved and I am ok with it. When there is no outside factors ...never a problem. (really, let's be realistic ...our instructors are way human too.)
9. Compatibility - yep. wonderful ...but since we are close in age and similar humor. It helps.
10. Focus - yes
11. Ability to see small mistakes - yes, has a knack for it.
12. Ability to make the lesson fun - ...it is learn learn learn ...but there are jokes and such when it gets to be way over the top.
13. Ability to make complex principles simple to do - He is working on it. I like that he can figure out when I am not getting it and switch to another way of teaching it
14. Ability to understand and explain principles from other "schools of thought" - uh ...he has no clue what "schools of thought" there are. he was like wha?
15. Ability to see the big picture - yes.
16. Ability to choreograph routines that are both entertaining and highlights the student's strengths - he is a master at this. great fun. also allows input from me as a student.
17. Showmanship - again a master at this. he was born to entertain
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Dora-Satya Veda
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« Reply #10 on: June 26, 2009, 02:09:03 PM »

I have to do two of these (one for my dance father and one for my dance mother).

My dance father:

1. Achievements – He was 4th in Blackpool as his best result. He had to retire early because of partner’s bad knees. He has taught most world finalist and semifinalist from the mid 1960 until 1997. He was examined to the level of Fellowship with the ISTD in England. He had a very successful studio in London for some 30 years. He was known worldwide as a master teacher and lecture.
2. Availability – He traveled a lot, so was not always available. When he was in town, he was always there for me day and night.
3. Book knowledge – He was examined to the level of Fellowship.
4. Price per lesson – I found ways of making funds available to pay him. I had 4 to 6 lessons with him a week.
5. Personality – He had a great personality. Everybody loved and adored him. He was always with a light heart. He always had a story or a joke to tell. He made learning into a game. At the same time he was very tough. When he gave you home work, he expected it done. If you had not done it there were no lessons until you did it and you still paid. I only did that mistake once. He had a heart of gold. He was extremely kind, caring and compassionate. He loved gambling and always found time to go to the dogs, horses or casinos. He lived life to the fullest. He was truly a grand master of teaching dance and a grand person.
6. Generosity – Beyond the norm. Very, very generous with time, information, insights and money. 
7. Punctuality – Now this was one of his few flaws. He was always about 15 minutes late. He did however always give you so much information that you only really need 30 minutes with him, anyway. He actually always gave my partner and me, the full time.
8. Reliability – Very reliable. He could always be trusted to do what he said he would do. 
9. Compatibility – He was a great parent. I think his light heart to my very deep thinking was perfect. He would get me doing and I would get him thinking.
10. Focus – Yes, he focused on you 100% when you were in a lesson, so I would say very much so.
11. Ability to see small mistakes – Yes, he could “smell” them. He could even “see” them when he had his back turned to you.
12. Ability to make the lesson fun – I always laughed a lot in his lessons. He always had a story or a joke on hand. He very firmly believed that you learned better when the mind and heart was light.
13. Ability to make complex principles simple to do – He was an absolute master at this. He would make everything simple. He actually would often say that when you understand the complexity, you can explain the simplicity. Everything was easy once he had told you what to do.
14. Ability to understand and explain principles from other "schools of thought" – Totally understood every bit of the different “schools of thought”. He created one of the “schools of thought”. He taught students from all the “schools of thought”. He had my partner and I work with all the “schools of thought” so that we would understand the nuances as well.
15. Ability to see the big picture – Yes absolutely. I actually think he was sometimes able to see the future.
16. Ability to choreograph routines that are both entertaining and highlights the student's strengths – He was a master at this. He would look at what you looked great doing and he would find ways to highlight it in every dance. He would find ways to hide your flaws and enhance your great abilities.
17. Showmanship – He was mister showmanship himself. He was a very charismatic person and he knew it. He used his charm to win over everybody’s heart.

My dance mother:

1. Achievements – She was several time amateur standard world champion and 8 times professional standard world champion. She has taught many world finalist and semifinalist. She is examined to the level of Fellowship with ISTD in England. She is known as one of the top lady teachers in the world today.
2. Availability – She travels a lot, so was not always available. When she was in town, she was always there for me day and night.
3. Book knowledge – She is examined to the level of Fellowship. She has also read numerous of other book relating to dance. She was the one that really got me into the study of how the mind works.
4. Price per lesson – I found a way of making funds available to pay her. I had 4 to 6 lessons with her a week.
5. Personality – She has a wonderful personality. She is always a lot of fun. She says things the way, she sees them. She is direct and to the point. She is very, very kind and caring. She takes care for you in all aspects of your life. She loves to cook and loves eating good food. She has a spark in her eyes, which tells you, she has some great comment on her tongue. She is witty and full of spark. Being around her is always fun and very informative. She is very educated not only in dance but many other subjects. She is a class act all the way around. She is a true joy to be around.
6. Generosity – Beyond the norm. Very, very generous with her time, information, insights and money. 
7. Punctuality – She is very punctual and always a little early.
8. Reliability – Very reliable. She can always be trusted to do what she says she will do. 
9. Compatibility – She is a great parent. She and I are very similar. She knew/knows me inside out. She helped me deal with my very direct, outspoken personality. I could see in her what a mature me should behave like. I am very proud to have her be my raw model for both dancing, behavior and manners in life. I can only hope one day to be as gracious and grand as she is.
10. Focus – Yes, she focuses on you 100% when you are in a lesson, so I would say very much so.
11. Ability to see small mistakes – Yes, she sees everything. She even catches you, if you thinking of making a mistake.
12. Ability to make the lesson fun – I always laugh a lot in her lessons. She has an ability to make lessons fun and information all at the same time.
13. Ability to make complex principles simple to do – She was an absolute master at this. She always helped/helps me find the simple, logic and easy way to accomplice the most complex of things/theories.
14. Ability to understand and explain principles from other "schools of thought" – Totally understand every bit of the different “schools of thought”. She teaches students from all the “schools of thought”. She helped my partner and I understand the differences and how to work with all the “schools of thought” so that we understood the nuances as well as being able to do the nuances.
15. Ability to see the big picture – Yes absolutely. I actually think she is sometimes able to see the future.
16. Ability to choreograph routines that are both entertaining and highlights the student's strengths – She didn’t do a lot of choreography. In England it is mostly the men that do choreography as that is one of the man’s 4 jobs. She is however able to help you execute the most difficult of choreography.
17. Showmanship – She is a very powerful and classy dancer. Her main focus is more into great technique. She is great at showing you how to present and show off great technique.

Dora-Satya Veda
« Last Edit: June 26, 2009, 02:12:50 PM by Dora-Satya Veda » Logged

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elisedance
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« Reply #11 on: June 27, 2009, 09:16:25 AM »

wow.  I think you derailed this topic into a much more interesting direction Smiley

anyone else dare go next?
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Rugby
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« Reply #12 on: July 01, 2009, 12:06:51 AM »

I think I can guess who.... lets see, west coast?

Yep.
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Everyone tries to rush up through the syllabus levles and think once they are at the top they have arrived.  What they don't realize is that by doing this it is like skimming through a book, you may get the gist but you will never understand the story.
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