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Author Topic: USA Dance chapters; Disadvantage and advantages?  (Read 1457 times)
dancewithutoo
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« on: April 15, 2012, 03:58:32 PM »

Im hoping to establish some sort Dance Society/club on hilton head island, sc.  The advantages, look to be clear from reading their web site.
What are some of the disadvantages and the biggest advantages?
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elisedance
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« Reply #1 on: April 15, 2012, 05:32:58 PM »

Can you tell us a bit more - many of us are not in the US (myself included, just north of the border but we also have members in Australia, taiwan, England in addition to the States). 

I guess a downsides might be abiding by their rules or their contracted associations - but from what I recall they are quite liberal on the latter (unlike us or Australia)...
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QPO
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« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2012, 04:35:45 AM »

Indeed....not sure about the state of play to comment on the advantages or disadvantages
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dancewithutoo
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« Reply #3 on: April 16, 2012, 07:17:29 AM »

Can you tell us a bit more - many of us are not in the US (myself included, just north of the border but we also have members in Australia, taiwan, England in addition to the States). 

I guess a downsides might be abiding by their rules or their contracted associations - but from what I recall they are quite liberal on the latter (unlike us or Australia)...
Big advantages are liability insurance,, music rights (that is a new one) and help setting up a non profit.
Disadvantages that I see are mostly minor, annual report is one but for me ,just starting out, is the requirement
to have 25 USA dance member and 51% must members in the the local. Need to be be over 18 but maybe college
student members rather than fully adult member. Unfortunately  two college near here don't seam to have dance teams or
clubs.   The ones in savannah do but then there is a chapter there.
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phoenix13
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« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2013, 09:51:50 PM »

So you're asking about the challenges of starting  USADance chapter?  I don't know because I've never started one.  But, having been a member of a few, here are my thoughts.

I think your second year will be harder than your first.  People wlll join initially but, unless they feel that they're getting bang for their membership buck, they will not renew.  Two: One really big, ongoing challenge that one of my previous chapters had was getting entertainment/pros to do group classes before the monthly dances.  Even after you find a standing venue for your dances, scheduling pros is an ongoing bit of work.  I think it's necessary, though, because it goes to the point I made above -- creating the impression in members that they're getting value for their money.

And, while we're at it, I'd be very surprised if USADance dances didn't have trouble breaking even.  By the time you consider the cost of the venue, the DJ, ASCAP fees, a dance pro, etc, I can't imagine it would be easy for a new chapter to generate enough revenue to pay for an event.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2013, 09:53:43 PM by phoenix13 » Logged

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phoenix13
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« Reply #5 on: May 02, 2013, 10:23:06 PM »

Oh yeah and one more challenge might be choosing which dances to focus on for classes and even for your dance socials.  Where you are, for example, you might have a lot of collegiate shag or Carolina shag.  Where I am, not so much.  Where I am, it's hand dancing or hustle (Aside: I never even heard of hand dancing until I started looking for Lindy hop lessons.  There are so many variations of swing.  But that's another conversation..)  Anyway.  where I am, smooth and rhythm are easy to find.  Standard and Latin are almost impossible to find danced socially.  Some competitive students do international, but it is not danced at USADance, as a rule. You're going to have to focus your events on the dances that people where you are want to dance, or else your attendance may be low.   KWIM?
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elisedance
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« Reply #6 on: May 03, 2013, 07:12:49 AM »

why is it that AM-AM entry fees are generally lower than pro-am?  It defies logic of course because because AM-AMs get to split the cost whereas the pro-am has to pay it by themselves - and of course all the other gzillion costs of doing pro-am. 

I suppose one could make a case that the young (career-track) AMs don't have an income - but thats certainly not the case for the senior evengs.
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phoenix13
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« Reply #7 on: May 03, 2013, 09:39:06 AM »

Don't know.  Hmm... actually. I should ask.  Do you mean entry fees for Am/Am versus Pro/Am at the same event?  I don't' know about that.  If the fees are lower for Am/Am, that really makes no sense to me.

OTOH, if you're talking costs overall, a lot of the Am/Am couples  I know compete primarily at college or USADance events, which are less expensive because they're non-profit.  Many, if not most, Pro/Ams compete at privately run events, which are for-profit businesses that charge what the market will bear -- lots and lots of cash, in some cases.
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elisedance
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« Reply #8 on: May 06, 2013, 05:24:03 AM »

Don't know.  Hmm... actually. I should ask.  Do you mean entry fees for Am/Am versus Pro/Am at the same event?  I don't' know about that.  If the fees are lower for Am/Am, that really makes no sense to me.
Take a look.  The current Emerald Ball has the fees classified - you have to write and ask for them.  Why do you think that is?  Why do fees for service have to be hidden?  As I see it its for two reasons: first it allows them to charge more for pro-ams AND it allows the pro to pass on an elevated fee to the student, bilking them out of even more money.  Its shameful.
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phoenix13
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« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2013, 09:03:32 AM »

Of course it's about money.I know of quite a few comps that do not publish a pricelist except to registered professionals, giving the pro the option to mark up the fees at will. But,to be fair,I also know of quite a few pros who sit down with their students and go over the actual pricelist, before negotiating pricing.
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elisedance
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« Reply #10 on: May 09, 2013, 10:53:03 PM »

jacking up the price is simply scalping.  the pro charges a fee - that fee should include everything ontop of the entry fees.  thats the honest way.
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QPO
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« Reply #11 on: May 09, 2013, 11:40:06 PM »

my earlier comment still applies Cheesy
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phoenix13
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« Reply #12 on: May 10, 2013, 02:21:23 AM »

jacking up the price is simply scalping.  the pro charges a fee - that fee should include everything ontop of the entry fees.  thats the honest way.


You could argue that.  I'm just saying that some comps are set up that way.  It's like the price list is some sort of state secret.  *shrug*
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elisedance
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« Reply #13 on: May 10, 2013, 07:50:56 AM »

jacking up the price is simply scalping.  the pro charges a fee - that fee should include everything ontop of the entry fees.  thats the honest way.


You could argue that.  I'm just saying that some comps are set up that way.  It's like the price list is some sort of state secret.  *shrug*

I know and its wrong.  When you buy anything else the seller may not tell you about how much he paid for it - but unless he is a scheister he would not go out of his way to lie about it just to squeeze more money out of you. 
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If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
phoenix13
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« Reply #14 on: May 10, 2013, 09:24:24 AM »

I hear ya.  

But (you saw that coming, didn't you?  Grin) at the end of the day, the pro's time must be paid for.  Whether he calculates it as mark-up per heat, charges a lump sum, or spreads the cost over several students doesn't matter to me as much as whether I think what he's charging is fair to me.

But yeah. I see why people say it's wrong and unfair. Particularly for students who are new to the game, there's a really big chance of getting taken for a ride.
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