partnerdanceonline.com
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
October 25, 2014, 01:32:42 AM

Login with username, password and session length
Search:     Advanced search
A lot of people are visiting Smiley Smiley
Undecided Undecided but not many are posting....
please say hi Cheesy
116470 Posts in 1856 Topics by 221 Members
Latest Member: EVE_Dance
* Home Help Search Calendar Login Register
+  partnerdanceonline.com
|-+  Partner Dancing
| |-+  Partner Dances
| | |-+  Ballroom dances - beginners, social and syllabus (Moderators: QPO, Rugby, cornutt, ZPomeroy)
| | | |-+  Rhythm or Latin - why, where, which level ...... ????????????
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
Pages: 1 [2] 3 Print
Author Topic: Rhythm or Latin - why, where, which level ...... ????????????  (Read 3183 times)
cornutt
Administrator
Silver
****
Posts: 1845


« Reply #15 on: April 24, 2009, 07:41:49 PM »


No, (American) Rhythm is similar to (International) Latin. The Rhythm dances are Rumba, Cha Cha, East Coast Swing, Mambo and Bolero. Latin dances are Rumba, Cha Cha, Jive, Samba and Paso Doble.

These days, a lot of American-style comps (particularly the NDCA ones) are also including West Coast Swing, Hustle, Meringue, and Salsa.  To me, it's the inclusion of the swing-based dances, plus bolero, that really distinguishes American Rhythm from International Latin.  The only swing-based dance in Latin is jive, and -- well, I won't say that it's sweetheartized, but it has gone through a unique development process, and it has moved further away from the roots of swing than any of the other common swing-based dances.

EDIT: that was an interesting word substitution by the software...  Shocked
Logged
MusicChica
Intermediate Silver
*
Posts: 1325


« Reply #16 on: April 24, 2009, 07:54:55 PM »

I think that has more to do with the fact that International Latin (and Standard, also) is far more "codified," if you will, than Rhythm.  The dances you mentioned are often offered as single-dance events, along with samba so that the people who love samba but don't dance any of the other Latin dances can compete in it without having to do so on a different day.  They're typically not offered as part of multi-dance events, such as DanceSport Series championships or scholarships, however.

International as a whole is much more structured--there is a single syllabus that is permitted for use, whereas I can think of at least 4 different syllabi that are acceptable for American.  There are absolutely no other dances that are included in the Latin style.
Logged
LucyDiamond
Open Bronze
*
Posts: 530


New Jersey


WWW
« Reply #17 on: April 24, 2009, 07:56:36 PM »


No, (American) Rhythm is similar to (International) Latin. The Rhythm dances are Rumba, Cha Cha, East Coast Swing, Mambo and Bolero. Latin dances are Rumba, Cha Cha, Jive, Samba and Paso Doble.

These days, a lot of American-style comps (particularly the NDCA ones) are also including West Coast Swing, Hustle, Meringue, and Salsa.... 

Yes, that's true for pro/am but not for pro/pro comps. I don't know about am/am.
Logged

"I believe that we are never more truly and profoundly human than when we dance” - José Limón
-------------------------------------
"Some people are always grumbling because roses have thorns; I am thankful that thorns have roses." ~Anonymous
Dora-Satya Veda
Gold Star
***
Posts: 6871


« Reply #18 on: April 25, 2009, 12:05:43 AM »

International as a whole is much more structured--there is a single syllabus that is permitted for use, whereas I can think of at least 4 different syllabi that are acceptable for American.  There are absolutely no other dances that are included in the Latin style.

You are right that there appears to be more structure in the international style.

I just have one little comment to the syllabi. There are actually two syllabi that are accepted in international latin and standard. They are IDTA and ISTD. It does depend which part of the world, you are in to which syllabi is the dominate one. In the US it is the ISTD that dominates and in the northern continental Europe it is the IDTA that dominates. In competitions in England they have invigilators’ from both societies to make sure they are both accepted and respected. 

I am not sure which society is the stronger one down under maybe of the many Aussies can help on that one.


Logged

"As we understand more things, everthing is becoming simpler"

Edward Teller
MusicChica
Intermediate Silver
*
Posts: 1325


« Reply #19 on: April 25, 2009, 12:25:42 AM »

I stand corrected.  I'm not familiar with the European scene, so I've never heard of IDTA.  Does anybody know if it's used at all here in the States?
Logged
malakawa
Open Bronze
*
Posts: 830



« Reply #20 on: April 25, 2009, 06:40:25 PM »

I stand corrected.  I'm not familiar with the European scene, so I've never heard of IDTA.  Does anybody know if it's used at all here in the States?

i use it + couple of more FA studios in this area (i don't know if it is because we have a lot of european teachers).

the problem is that even when i see pro's dancing am rhythm (for example cha cha), i see intl. style. (the person that pointed that out was, when i asked, corky ballas).

i think that there is no good dancers that dance rhythm & latin. because when it comes to dancing most important thing is muscle memory.  when you have on style in your muscle memory it is hard to transfer in the other one.

just learned couple of huge differences in both styles. and for me as a intl. dancer, rhytm is a little bit ackward.  Cool
« Last Edit: April 25, 2009, 06:42:04 PM by malakawa » Logged

Ginger Rogers did everything Fred Astaire did, but she did it backwards and in high heels.

It takes an athlete to dance, but an artist to be a dancer.
MusicChica
Intermediate Silver
*
Posts: 1325


« Reply #21 on: April 25, 2009, 07:56:43 PM »

i use it + couple of more FA studios in this area (i don't know if it is because we have a lot of european teachers).

the problem is that even when i see pro's dancing am rhythm (for example cha cha), i see intl. style. (the person that pointed that out was, when i asked, corky ballas).

i think that there is no good dancers that dance rhythm & latin. because when it comes to dancing most important thing is muscle memory.  when you have on style in your muscle memory it is hard to transfer in the other one.

just learned couple of huge differences in both styles. and for me as a intl. dancer, rhytm is a little bit ackward.  Cool

The reason for that is that Rhythm is slowly turning into Latin, just with different dances.  The bent-leg style in Rhythm is disappearing, which is just tragic.  It's the biggest thing that distinguishes Rhythm from Latin, and a lot of people suspect this change is occuring because there are too many Latin-trained judges judging Rhythm who think that Rhythm is ugly and pointless.

Which I agree with to a point--if the basic Rhythm technique (i.e. bent leg) disappears and is replaced with technique identical to Latin, they're right, there isn't a point to Rhythm.  That's why top competitors and coaches need to stick to their guns and not conform to the current trend of dancing Rhythm with Latin technique.  Rhythm needs to be danced the way Rhythm was meant to be danced, not as the sweetheart redheaded stepchild of Latin.  It's just as valid a style.
Logged
Dora-Satya Veda
Gold Star
***
Posts: 6871


« Reply #22 on: April 26, 2009, 11:39:56 AM »

I stand corrected.  I'm not familiar with the European scene, so I've never heard of IDTA.  Does anybody know if it's used at all here in the States?

Yes, the IDTA books are used in the US. The Terpsichore society was founded as a way to do your examinations in the US using the IDTA books.

It is Walter Laird that wrote the latin technique book for the IDTA and Guy Howard that wrote the standard technique book for the IDTA.   

Most of the resent world finalist (the last 10 to 15 years) from Europe has done their exams using the IDTA books.
Logged

"As we understand more things, everthing is becoming simpler"

Edward Teller
elisedance
Administrator
Blackpool Finalist
*****
Posts: 35013


ee


« Reply #23 on: March 18, 2010, 06:45:09 AM »

In the old days I competed in both latin and rhythm.  I still dance both but compete in latin and do rhythm for fun, though I am heading for my gold rhythm medals in May.  I find both styles very much alike in terms of moves.

Did you do these medals R?  How did you get on if so?
Logged

If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
Rugby
Moderator
Gold
****
Posts: 3599



« Reply #24 on: April 19, 2010, 09:36:02 PM »

I got all the medals done and given Highly Commended on them all and was also taken aside and told that that is how they should be danced.  I didn't worry about technique so much as presentation and went for the fun of it.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2010, 09:38:51 PM by Rugby » Logged

Everyone tries to rush up through the syllabus levles and think once they are at the top they have arrived.  What they don't realize is that by doing this it is like skimming through a book, you may get the gist but you will never understand the story.
elisedance
Administrator
Blackpool Finalist
*****
Posts: 35013


ee


« Reply #25 on: April 20, 2010, 01:13:14 AM »

I got all the medals done and given Highly Commended on them all and was also taken aside and told that that is how they should be danced.  I didn't worry about technique so much as presentation and went for the fun of it.

So who ran these that presentation was the priority?
Logged

If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
Rugby
Moderator
Gold
****
Posts: 3599



« Reply #26 on: April 23, 2010, 11:09:30 PM »

Alan Armsby
Logged

Everyone tries to rush up through the syllabus levles and think once they are at the top they have arrived.  What they don't realize is that by doing this it is like skimming through a book, you may get the gist but you will never understand the story.
elisedance
Administrator
Blackpool Finalist
*****
Posts: 35013


ee


« Reply #27 on: April 24, 2010, 03:42:38 AM »

How interesting!  I wonder if thats his priority as a judge too.
Logged

If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
TangoDancer
Open Bronze
*
Posts: 736



« Reply #28 on: April 24, 2010, 05:11:01 AM »

The reason for that is that Rhythm is slowly turning into Latin, just with different dances.  The bent-leg style in Rhythm is disappearing, which is just tragic.  It's the biggest thing that distinguishes Rhythm from Latin, and a lot of people suspect this change is occuring because there are too many Latin-trained judges judging Rhythm who think that Rhythm is ugly and pointless.

This is qute untrue. In actuality, when really studied, one realizes that the 2 styles are quite similar in technique, except for the timing of the  weight placement that causes the bent/straight leg look. Re the reason, it is solely because there was/is such a huge influx of Russian/Euro dancers into the US, who danced in comps, but did not know the amer style. The judges and/or powers that were/be did not stop them, and now we are stuck with what I smiling call amernational.  Smiley
Logged

The most beautiful part of the dance is often found in between the steps... and in the movement within the stillness.
cornutt
Administrator
Silver
****
Posts: 1845


« Reply #29 on: April 24, 2010, 06:34:51 PM »


This is qute untrue. In actuality, when really studied, one realizes that the 2 styles are quite similar in technique, except for the timing of the  weight placement that causes the bent/straight leg look.

I think that's what MC was actually getting at.  And while it might not be that much of a technique difference, it is a pretty big stylistic difference. 

Quote
The judges and/or powers that were/be did not stop them, and now we are stuck with what I smiling call amernational.  Smiley

I wonder why the judging community allowed this to happen?  I have observed that it has led to some bad habits on the part of people who are trying to imitate the style without really understanding the mechanics... they do it by never bending their knees, and then they look like they are dancing on stilts.   Roll Eyes
Logged
Pages: 1 [2] 3 Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2008, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!