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Author Topic: Sport or Art?  (Read 1771 times)
elisedance
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« Reply #15 on: January 05, 2012, 08:07:47 AM »

Let's take culinary arts, then place the cook in a show like Iron Chef.  Very physical, timed, and competing against another chef.  Does it become a sport?  I don't have a problem calling it a competition, but I don't know if I'd call it a sport... unless of ofcourse Iron Chef is a sport. 


I think we can find many different comparison in favour of both. I think it is an artistic sport. If we go back to the definition of a sport we are a sport but never the twain will meet. Cheesy

I think the term 'artistic sport' is a good one Q.  The difference between a 'sport' and an 'artistic sport' is that the latter contains an element of subjectivity.  Thus, in long jump you can measure precisely the distance jumped but in Waltz there is a matter of 'personal opinion' that can not be reviewed objectively.  And that has been the bane of such competetive events that include ice dancing and even dressage I guess. 

Perhaps the artistic sports should be separated into their own olympic event.  Its a bit like separating the hard sciences (physics, chemistry etc which can be tested objectively) from the soft ones such as sociology and psychology, which often involve a subjective element.
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QPO
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« Reply #16 on: January 05, 2012, 06:20:27 PM »

Let's take culinary arts, then place the cook in a show like Iron Chef.  Very physical, timed, and competing against another chef.  Does it become a sport?  I don't have a problem calling it a competition, but I don't know if I'd call it a sport... unless of ofcourse Iron Chef is a sport. 


I think we can find many different comparison in favour of both. I think it is an artistic sport. If we go back to the definition of a sport we are a sport but never the twain will meet. Cheesy


Perhaps the artistic sports should be separated into their own olympic event.  Its a bit like separating the hard sciences (physics, chemistry etc which can be tested objectively) from the soft ones such as sociology and psychology, which often involve a subjective element.


I have heard rumors that this is possible. I think it may also be a reason why it has yet to be in the current listing of Olympics. when it will happen ....not sure...
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« Reply #17 on: March 21, 2013, 01:52:42 AM »

this is still an ongoing issue  in this country and seems to have two camps. I am going to hear a lecture tonight by Andrew Sinkinson so I will be interested to hear what he will spruik on the matter. I know he is known for being the King of Foxtrot...so I hope that is where the lecture will stay:D
« Last Edit: March 23, 2013, 12:34:34 AM by QPO » Logged

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elisedance
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« Reply #18 on: March 22, 2013, 04:24:51 AM »

partner dancing is neither first, the second second, and the first third....

First its just people enjoying moving their bodies together ... though that does sound like something else how can you truly separate them?
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QPO
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« Reply #19 on: March 23, 2013, 01:13:49 AM »

partner dancing is neither first, the second second, and the first third....

First its just people enjoying moving their bodies together ... though that does sound like something else how can you truly separate them?

Well I dont believe that you can but most people think of it as an art but if you are competing against others then does it not become a competition that then becomes a sport.  How many other discipline in the arts compete against each other?
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elisedance
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« Reply #20 on: March 23, 2013, 03:55:56 AM »

partner dancing is neither first, the second second, and the first third....

First its just people enjoying moving their bodies together ... though that does sound like something else how can you truly separate them?

Well I dont believe that you can but most people think of it as an art but if you are competing against others then does it not become a competition that then becomes a sport.  How many other discipline in the arts compete against each other?
Actually - many.  Ice skating is the obvious one but one can find many examples.  Competitions are the key way that soloist (classical) violinist and pianists become recognized.  Indeed, its hard to have a career as a soloist unless you win a big competition.  There are competitions in anything that people are interested in seeing who's best. 
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phoenix13
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« Reply #21 on: May 07, 2013, 11:14:39 AM »

I'm going to throw my vote in with the artistic sport contingent.   Cool  To me, dancesport looks a lot like figure skating.  Clearly, there's a subjective component to the judging process. Also clearly, aesthetics and artistic expression play a large role.  But no one argues that a figure skater is not an athlete. 


Not sure why so many people argue that dancesport athletes aren't athletes.
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« Reply #22 on: May 07, 2013, 09:36:16 PM »

I'm going to throw my vote in with the artistic sport contingent.   Cool  To me, dancesport looks a lot like figure skating.  Clearly, there's a subjective component to the judging process. Also clearly, aesthetics and artistic expression play a large role.  But no one argues that a figure skater is not an athlete. 


Not sure why so many people argue that dancesport athletes aren't athletes.

Well I complicate this more at WDC members refuse to even mention that they are athletes and the WDSF see it as a sport. Once they come to an agreement then people might find middle ground, as I am of the opinion that it is artistic sport.
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phoenix13
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« Reply #23 on: May 07, 2013, 10:10:03 PM »

Those almighty organizational conflicts complicate everything.  *sigh*
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elisedance
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« Reply #24 on: May 08, 2013, 07:18:20 AM »

Those almighty organizational conflicts complicate everything.  *sigh*
you've got that right!  OTOH they do make us think and struggle with things such as this topic.

An interesting question is 'why ballroom?'
We don't have competetive ballet and its frowned upon in other dance forms such as modern or even argentine tango.  You define something according to what you personally want to get out of it.

Ballroom is probably first and formost not an art or a sport, but an activity - I'll call that 'basic ballroom'.  Most people do it as a social activity where you get up move in motion with a partner to music and then sit down again!  Its an art if your objective is to use it to express something to a viewer - viewers are not necessary for basic ballroom.  Its a sport if you do it with defined rules (rules, other than having the same way of dancing together, are not a part of basic ballroom either) and an authority (read judge, also not required for basic ballroom) decides whether you do it better, within those rules, than another couple.

Thus trying to decide if ballroom is an art or a sport is really a waste of time because ballroom is not 'one' thing - its a family of them.
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phoenix13
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« Reply #25 on: May 08, 2013, 08:38:53 AM »

True.  But that hasn't stopped hoards of people from pondering the question lo these many years.  Wink Smiley
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QPO
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« Reply #26 on: May 08, 2013, 08:58:42 AM »

But the thing it needs to work out what it is otherwise where do you go to try and get funding?  every-time I have tried to get television coverage I get put through to the arts section, and I say what about sports coverage and they go Huh? yet most of the funding available out there is for participation and comes under sports.

So we need to have consensus so we know so the public and funding bodies know where to put us for financial assistance.
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phoenix13
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« Reply #27 on: May 08, 2013, 09:27:34 AM »

Hmm.  I hadn't thought about funding.  Of course, in the US, categorizing dance under sport could open a whole new set of problems, since funding for sports at the collegiate level is already very competitive.  Until Title IX, it was very difficult for women's sports to get funding at all, and even now, the bigger, more visible (more lucrative) sports such as football and basketball get the bulk of the funding.  (Not saying that dance is a women's sport, but that getting funding is competitive for any sport.)

Here in the US, placing dance under the sport umbrella might do more harm than good. *sigh*
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