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Author Topic: WDC vs WDSF  (Read 9986 times)
elisedance
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ee


« Reply #15 on: June 03, 2013, 10:47:50 AM »

I don't have time to find one - but look at QS for a WDSF final (there was a recent championship in Paris) and compare that to Bpool.  Aparently the WDSC judges use a point system to judge - like ice skating.

I think that was added as part of the Olympics campaign (a big factor of the WDSC success).
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phoenix13
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« Reply #16 on: June 03, 2013, 01:38:01 PM »

Holy cow!    Thanks for the recommendation.  The difference is visible even to my untutored eye.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kwPCCsN_p0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xP80Yx0xTKY
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elisedance
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« Reply #17 on: June 03, 2013, 01:47:35 PM »

well which do you prefer?
[and thanks for the links, kinda illustrates it well!]
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phoenix13
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« Reply #18 on: June 03, 2013, 01:55:36 PM »

At first impression, I'd have to go with WDSF, but I'll google some more examples, to be sure.   WDSF style is a lot more ... exciting?  youthful-looking? I don't know.  Let me look at a few more examples, then Ill be back. Cool
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elisedance
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« Reply #19 on: June 03, 2013, 02:20:15 PM »

At first impression, I'd have to go with WDSF, but I'll google some more examples, to be sure.   WDSF style is a lot more ... exciting?  youthful-looking? I don't know.  Let me look at a few more examples, then Ill be back. Cool
OK, now look at the waltz and tell me which feels more like how you imaging a waltz to be?
this is fun...
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phoenix13
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« Reply #20 on: June 03, 2013, 11:22:41 PM »

I couldn't find apples to apples comparison of just the waltz this morning, but you are right. this is fun.  Time for googling.  Smiley
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QPO
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« Reply #21 on: June 03, 2013, 11:43:26 PM »

having seem both up close and personal. I like some dances that are WDSF style but I have concerns is that the divide between each dance is getting less. How do you mean you may ask. each style except for tango has so many quick's in it to create time to have over exaggerated picture lines. It is not necessarily restful to watch. I find the masters dance more WDC style and it is much easier to watch and pick the winners.

I just wish they could both find a middle ground, dancing was never meant to be static from a changes perspective.
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phoenix13
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« Reply #22 on: June 04, 2013, 12:15:27 AM »

Hmm.  Interesting.  I'll have to look at (and post) some more videos before I can reply.  And do you mean just standard, or Latin as well?  Cool
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QPO
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« Reply #23 on: June 04, 2013, 12:41:59 AM »

Hmm.  Interesting.  I'll have to look at (and post) some more videos before I can reply.  And do you mean just standard, or Latin as well?  Cool

mostly standard. I dont have the finesse to make comments on Latin
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phoenix13
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« Reply #24 on: June 04, 2013, 10:20:02 AM »

having seem both up close and personal. I like some dances that are WDSF style but I have concerns is that the divide between each dance is getting less. How do you mean you may ask. each style except for tango has so many quick's in it to create time to have over exaggerated picture lines. It is not necessarily restful to watch. I find the masters dance more WDC style and it is much easier to watch and pick the winners.

I just wish they could both find a middle ground, dancing was never meant to be static from a changes perspective.

I still have to google up those videos I promised; I haven't forgotten. Cool

A few thoughts on this post.  I agree that dance was never meant to be static, but I'm not sure that the two organizations finding a middle ground would necessarily be my preference from a dance perspective.  I do think it would be better for most** dance competitors if both groups learned to get along politically (I say this knowing full well how ignorant  am so I could be completely off base. Smiley  )  But is it possible that the two organizations evolving separately is actually helping to broaden the art form?  Two different schools of thought, so to speak, that might at some point complement each other?

As far as watching the dance itself is concerned, I think it's a matter of personal preference. I've heard people say that the WDC approach requires more athleticism  because it requires more control.   OTOH, I've heard people say that the WDSF approach requires more vitality and expression.  Eh.  As my Dad always says, you pay your money and you make your choice.  (Dad is smart in the way only a 90 year old man can be. Cool )   I think we can all agree that, by the time you get to the top echelons of the dance world that we're discussing everybody on the floor is an elite dance athlete.


** I say most because the very top finalists arguably would not be better off.  Two organizations = two sets of finalists = twice the opportunity for every couple to make it to the top.

More to come  after I watch some videos. Smiley
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elisedance
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« Reply #25 on: June 04, 2013, 10:34:23 PM »

If you change the character of a dance when does it become a different dance?  Of course competition dancing is nothing like salon or village green dancing so its already become a different dance.  But I think the original intent has been preserved. 

As far as I am concerned, if they take the give and take of a relationship out of ballroom I won'be beinterested any more.  And, to be honest, thats what I fear is happening iwth the WDCF style. 

I think they should put both styles on the same competition floor and judge which is more interesting, expressive and artistic.  I have little doubt which would win.  OTOH if it was which is more athletic it would be the other one.  So it depends what dance  is to you ...
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QPO
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« Reply #26 on: June 04, 2013, 10:54:55 PM »

Well WDC would be horrified if you say athleticism as that would imply a sport...and they do not believe they are a sport but an art.  I dont believe their fight is about creativity anymore it is about power.
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millitiz
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« Reply #27 on: June 05, 2013, 04:07:08 AM »

I am with Phoenix on this. As long as there is freedom of choice, I don't see having two organizations/styles would be that much of a problem.

As for my reason, As someone and P13 had noted, a bit of variation, and a bit of competition shouldn't hurt us the customers/competitors.

As for trends...In order to answer how far is too far, we have to of course ask ourselves, what are the essences of ballroom dancing. These are the core concepts defining ballroom dancing. IMHO, with a few exceptions, they really vary from person to person. And that is when two organizations/trends becoming helpful. If you think that WDSF is too athletic, no problem, then compete in WDC events. If you think that WDC dancing is "for old people," also great: welcome to WDSF.

I think the other way of looking at the question is - yes, WDSF's couples probably have gone too far. But without people pushing the boundaries, how do we know where to stop? And imho, if I have to choose between too much and not enough, I'd prefer too much.

As for doubling the amount of finals...I don't know. It means that people have double the chance to be a finalist (which is probably a good thing). And if people have the freedom of choices, I would dare say that the finalists in one org is roughly the same as the other. The only problem I could think of (and is kinda happening right now) is if you are champion in one org but become, oh, I don't know, sixth place in the other org.
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elisedance
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« Reply #28 on: June 05, 2013, 05:15:22 AM »

I think you put that very well MZ.  the biggest problem with two organizations is the clashes - and we've seen a LOT of that.  a bit of competition between them might be a good thing but it can get out of hand - such as with the boycotts and attempts to ban or sabotage the other group. 

If they can 'live and let live' then I do agree. 
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phoenix13
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« Reply #29 on: June 05, 2013, 08:33:31 AM »


As for doubling the amount of finals...I don't know. It means that people have double the chance to be a finalist (which is probably a good thing). And if people have the freedom of choices, I would dare say that the finalists in one org is roughly the same as the other. The only problem I could think of (and is kinda happening right now) is if you are champion in one org but become, oh, I don't know, sixth place in the other org.

In this case it's about politics, not dancing, which stinks, IMV.
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Dona nobis pacem.
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