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Author Topic: Partner dance or Pantomime?  (Read 1781 times)
elisedance
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« Reply #15 on: June 04, 2013, 02:08:21 PM »

[least there is any misunderstanding Roll Eyes ]
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phoenix13
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« Reply #16 on: June 04, 2013, 02:14:02 PM »

ROTFL!  I understand.  Completely.

Not sure I agree, though.   I'll post more later today, when I have time to write something more in depth.

« Last Edit: June 04, 2013, 02:27:34 PM by phoenix13 » Logged

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phoenix13
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« Reply #17 on: June 04, 2013, 03:23:47 PM »

For me, some of this topic boils down to how you define lead.  To me, lead is indicating to your partner what needs to be done next, plain and simple.  To me, the brand new lead who says out loud, "Let's try crossover breaks," is leading crossover breaks, maybe not as elegantly as an experienced lead who might use his core.  but, at the end of the day, he's led the crossover breaks. I  can tell because I've managed to dance crossover breaks more or less when he wanted me to.  Hence we have lead and follow.  Cool

More later. Smiley
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elisedance
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« Reply #18 on: June 05, 2013, 07:35:02 AM »

I should add that this is what dance is for ME - obviously others may differ.  Indeed, if there was no lead-follow I would not do ballroom.

That said there are plenty of ballroom couples to whom lead-follow means start dancing and stop dancing.  The bits in between are choreographed with each dancer knowing exactly what to do.  This works well for them - and for judges in comps too.  Likewise for many social leads - they learn a sequence of, say 20 steps and always do them in precisely the same sequence - if they have to stop they either start from the beginning or, if more advanced, continue from where they stopped.

Also, lead-follow is MUCH more than letting me know what step it is, although that is obviously an essential start. Once led I will dance the step - unless I feel a counter lead in the middle - but I will sense all sorts of additional information during the step, the delicious part of the lead-follow communication - which tells me how dramatic the expression is and even what kind of mood the lead is in at that moment.  I take that information and add my own expression to it - I'm not passive by any means but what I do has to be a continuation, a culmination of the leads intent.  This is lead-follow to me and what I savor the most about ballroom dance.
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phoenix13
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« Reply #19 on: June 26, 2013, 07:02:28 PM »

Makes sense.  Lead follow can mean different things to different people.  To me,leads are kinda like eggs.  At their simplest, you can boil them.  But you can also scramble,fry,make an omelette,make a frittata, make a souffle...   IMV, just because it's not a souffle doesn't make it not eggs.
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elisedance
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« Reply #20 on: November 05, 2014, 10:31:45 PM »

Makes sense.  Lead follow can mean different things to different people.  To me,leads are kinda like eggs.  At their simplest, you can boil them.  But you can also scramble,fry,make an omelette,make a frittata, make a souffle...   IMV, just because it's not a souffle doesn't make it not eggs.
Kinda lost me a bit here PX!  I'm drowning in the egg custard of your analogy Cheesy
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« Reply #21 on: November 18, 2014, 07:16:23 PM »

Hmm, for some reason this thread popped up in my "responses" list, and it's perfectly timely, because I was just thinking about this the other day. 

I am now a firm believer that no routine, whatsoever, is necessary, and any compromise thereof is cheating.  Maybe for a competition you would like a more rehearsed set of figures so that you display your best at all times, but apart from that, lead and follow should be just that.  None of these "connectors" and "queues" and whatnot. 
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elisedance
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« Reply #22 on: November 18, 2014, 07:43:38 PM »

Hmm, for some reason this thread popped up in my "responses" list, and it's perfectly timely, because I was just thinking about this the other day. 

I am now a firm believer that no routine, whatsoever, is necessary, and any compromise thereof is cheating.  Maybe for a competition you would like a more rehearsed set of figures so that you display your best at all times, but apart from that, lead and follow should be just that.  None of these "connectors" and "queues" and whatnot. 

Right on!  I have no problem with learning my partner's dance figures and even routine - but only by dancing it, not by rote.  I tried to explain that to my pro - the effect of learning is to create two partners, the one in my arms and the one in my head and they never really agree with the important stuff.  that being the physical expression of emotion - the whole point of dancing.
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If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
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