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Author Topic: Blaming Your Dance Partner  (Read 10668 times)
Some guy
Intermediate Silver
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Posts: 1455


« Reply #150 on: July 24, 2009, 11:48:04 AM »

this blaming your partner thingy has gotten out of control. in my last standard lesson I was taken to task by the male instructor for whining that I was unable to do a step because of my partner. now I dont remember whining but I do recall trying to explain what I was feeling and could pin it down to a particular whisk type movement. it was so uncomfortable and confrontational I had to change the subject in order to move forward in the lesson. I dont think I realize how arrogant I am or how unjustified my attitude is toward my partner. its unsettling to think if I change for the better that we will be two women dancing
I feel your pain catsmeow.  I really do.  I've been yelled at by my instructor about "complaining" when in fact I saw it as just trying to understand why, if I was doing everything the instructor told me to do, my partner still felt "heavy".  I learned much later on that it wasn't my partner's fault, but guess what: I don't believe it was my fault either.  Technically it was my fault, but my coach at the time left out such a crucial aspect of the gentleman's part that it was no wonder my partner felt "heavy" to me.  I was framed, set up, kind of like being sent to a gunfight with a toy pistol that shot out a tiny banner that read, "Bang!".  Then subsequently complaining that I'm getting mortally wounded while my opponent isn't even flinching to the shots I fire.  

What you did was noble and great: you changed the subject and moved on.  Later on, with more insight, you can revisit the event and understand exactly who is to blame.  I wish I was as wise.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2009, 11:51:29 AM by Some guy » Logged
catsmeow
Bronze
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Posts: 339


« Reply #151 on: July 24, 2009, 01:58:12 PM »

Thankyou Some Guy. We suffer as one! Please join me in my crusade for fair treatment towards male dancers. God only knows there is prejudice enough against us. F'rinstance: try telling a bunch of redneck industrial league ballplayers that dancing would help them lose their paunch. Then go tell it to their husbands.
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elisedance
Administrator
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Posts: 34977


ee


« Reply #152 on: July 24, 2009, 02:10:57 PM »

......its unsettling to think if I change for the better that we will be two women dancing........

Shocked Shocked

..which begs the question: is it masculine to be reasonable??  or am I missing something...
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If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
Rugby
Moderator
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Posts: 3585



« Reply #153 on: July 24, 2009, 10:30:25 PM »

As mentioned to me many a time, male and reasonable are usually not used in the same sentence.
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Everyone tries to rush up through the syllabus levles and think once they are at the top they have arrived.  What they don't realize is that by doing this it is like skimming through a book, you may get the gist but you will never understand the story.
QPO
reg mods
Continental Champion
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Posts: 20804


Adelaide South Australia


« Reply #154 on: July 25, 2009, 02:39:32 AM »

oooo that is a bit general, not something I would choose to say publicly Roll Eyes

I have seen a few unreasonable women also Shocked
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Dance is a delicate balance between perfection and beauty.  ~Author Unknown
Dance Forum
Ginger
Bronze
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Posts: 497

I see what you did there.


« Reply #155 on: July 25, 2009, 02:44:47 AM »

I have learned:

If it's a technical issue, it's my fault.

If it's an issue in memorizing choreo, it's my fault.

If there's something to be upset about, everyone else can, but if I am, I'm being a hateful bitch.

I can't teach- I get too technical and over their heads, or I don't focus enough on those aspects.

I can't choreo- my stuff is too confusing and silly.

Why, exactly, do I dance again? I keep forgetting lately. I can't communicate, I can't think, I can't move... I'm not being sarcastic when I say the abovementioned. I ... just... *can't*... it's crazy.
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elisedance
Administrator
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ee


« Reply #156 on: July 25, 2009, 05:28:52 AM »

I have learned:

If it's a technical issue, it's my fault.

If it's an issue in memorizing choreo, it's my fault.

If there's something to be upset about, everyone else can, but if I am, I'm being a hateful bitch.

I can't teach- I get too technical and over their heads, or I don't focus enough on those aspects.

I can't choreo- my stuff is too confusing and silly.

Why, exactly, do I dance again? I keep forgetting lately. I can't communicate, I can't think, I can't move... I'm not being sarcastic when I say the abovementioned. I ... just... *can't*... it's crazy.

You dance Ginger, for the same reason the rest of us do - because you love to - and probably have to, dance.  The rest has to just keep up with that need.

Perhaps what you need to do is to do just that - do some dancing in an environment where there are no expectations - go social dancing, do the mazurka or country dancing.  You will almost certainly find that suddenly you love it again and coming back to 'serious' partner dancing will be a lot more fun....
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If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
Rugby
Moderator
Gold
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Posts: 3585



« Reply #157 on: July 25, 2009, 11:01:49 PM »

oooo that is a bit general, not something I would choose to say publicly Roll Eyes

I have seen a few unreasonable women also Shocked
 

Oddly enough it has been men that have told me this and I have even heard it being said on t.v. on talk shows twice, by men.  They were saying that women always like to reason everything out and this drives men crazy as they are not into reasoning.  Of course that does not mean all men.     
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Everyone tries to rush up through the syllabus levles and think once they are at the top they have arrived.  What they don't realize is that by doing this it is like skimming through a book, you may get the gist but you will never understand the story.
Some guy
Intermediate Silver
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Posts: 1455


« Reply #158 on: July 26, 2009, 12:48:28 AM »

I have learned:

If it's a technical issue, it's my fault.

If it's an issue in memorizing choreo, it's my fault.

If there's something to be upset about, everyone else can, but if I am, I'm being a hateful bitch.

I can't teach- I get too technical and over their heads, or I don't focus enough on those aspects.

I can't choreo- my stuff is too confusing and silly.

Why, exactly, do I dance again? I keep forgetting lately. I can't communicate, I can't think, I can't move... I'm not being sarcastic when I say the abovementioned. I ... just... *can't*... it's crazy.

Hang in there Ginger.  When I read that it sounded like something I would've typed.  It gets only better.  Give it some time.  Look within yourself for answers.  You'll be amazed at what you find.
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QPO
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Continental Champion
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Adelaide South Australia


« Reply #159 on: July 26, 2009, 03:25:06 AM »

Yes get centered again, don't let those things effect you ( I know that is hard), if you generally don't believe that it is true then you have to ask the person why they think this is this case and remarks like that are not helping your dancing and quite the opposite.

Look at a new approach to your dancing, don't focus  on what you don't do well, focus on what you do do well and improve the others.

You love dancing and they do to so there is common ground

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Dance is a delicate balance between perfection and beauty.  ~Author Unknown
Dance Forum
Ginger
Bronze
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Posts: 497

I see what you did there.


« Reply #160 on: July 27, 2009, 11:36:31 PM »

I have to keep thinking "They mean me no harm, this is just how they are"... because she really doesn't, but still, once in awhile, something really jabs in and draws blood. The boneheaded, blunt wandering aimlessly around with scissors until someone loses an eye is almost worse than a pointed aim-and-jab, I don't know why.

If it'll just even out like I think it sort of has, it'll be fine.
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Some guy
Intermediate Silver
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Posts: 1455


« Reply #161 on: July 28, 2009, 02:03:47 PM »

I have to keep thinking "They mean me no harm, this is just how they are"... because she really doesn't, but still, once in awhile, something really jabs in and draws blood. The boneheaded, blunt wandering aimlessly around with scissors until someone loses an eye is almost worse than a pointed aim-and-jab, I don't know why.

If it'll just even out like I think it sort of has, it'll be fine.

It is hard to believe that they mean you no harm, but it's helpful to think that they are indeed simply running around with scissors.  The stab wound nonetheless shows signs of precision, intent, and power... and you're right, it draws blood and hurts like "H" "E" double hockey-sticks. 

I'm still struggling with how to deal with this.
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skipper
Bronze
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Posts: 376


« Reply #162 on: October 04, 2009, 11:43:42 PM »

I have learned:

If it's a technical issue, it's my fault.

If it's an issue in memorizing choreo, it's my fault.

If there's something to be upset about, everyone else can, but if I am, I'm being a hateful bitch.

I can't teach- I get too technical and over their heads, or I don't focus enough on those aspects.

I can't choreo- my stuff is too confusing and silly.

Why, exactly, do I dance again? I keep forgetting lately. I can't communicate, I can't think, I can't move... I'm not being sarcastic when I say the abovementioned. I ... just... *can't*... it's crazy.
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cdnsalsanut
Bronze
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Posts: 256



« Reply #163 on: October 12, 2009, 02:09:28 PM »

I'm having difficulty with a dance partner.  I have two, one very strong in latin one very strong in standard.

They both want to compete in both events, latin and standard.  The latin one, let's call the "the russian", was my first dance partner, when I started learning ballroom about a year and a half ago. We took lessons together and danced socially, she has a boyfriend but wants to dance at a high level, uses me as a practice partner and social dance partner. But as she said once: "He's just my dance partner". Fair enough.  After 3 months she dropped me like a hot potatoe. We were with a creepy molesting type dance teacher and I think he told her I was bad for her dancing. We continued to practice together and social dance together.

So I found a new partner, fantastic dancer. The "Czech". Also has a b'friend. We danced and took lessons together, she hadn't danced for 25 years but was junior champion and happy to learn along with me through bronze and silver syllabus.  We won a number of comps this summer (she's obviously amazing dancer and the judges must be looking at her...happy to ride along on her coattails) but then she hurt her hip flexor and is out.

I found another partner, "the Oriental". Also has b'friend. Very good standard. Because I work shifts l can work with her and the Russian alternately and it works out well. But as my dancing has improved I've started to move beyond the Russian and find her std frame poor, moveable, noodle arms often and heavy follow. The other partner is superb and when we're dancing it allows me to work on improving my technique. When dancing std with the Russian it's invariably about improving her frame and technique and helping her learn the  routine.

We practiced last night and had a terrible night. Every time she loses frame I remind her, I'll just say "frame", but because poor frame it affects following and she's often doing her own thing, guessing; we're disconnected and the dancing is sloppy with many mistakes. We compete in both latin and std in a couple of weeks and it's obvious she hasn't learned the std routines.

She was very upset with me last night, said I was overly critical.  I try not to be but need her to learn the routines and keep her frame. Also, she thinks she's a much better dancer than she actually is and both our teachers have privately said to me I should just have one partner and work with the Oriental.

Having two suits my purposes, allows me to practice daily and dance every day, invariably when one or the other are busy with b'frinds I have another good partner to dance with. I like them both and we get along fine.

I want to continue dancing with the Russian but don't know how to encourage her to improve if I'm not allowed to say anything. She only wants me to encourage her and i understand the sentiment, I don't wwork well if people point out my shortcomings constantly, I just get worse and worse. So I'm stuck, I need and want her to improve but don't know how to if I'm not allowed to point out mistakes.
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"There are short-cuts to happiness, and dancing is one of them."
~Vicki Baum
Some guy
Intermediate Silver
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Posts: 1455


« Reply #164 on: October 12, 2009, 03:03:17 PM »

Is it possible to let a coach/pro point out her mistakes?

As for multiple partners, I think the person in the best position to make that decision is ultimately you.  I would suggest using the approach that improves you the most.  Sometimes it's worth partnering up with the person with the most potential for growth and the most potential for you to grow as a dancer.  That partner is not necessarily the best dancer in the pool of potential dance partners.  If it's a quick temporary win you're after, then the best dancer is the best bet.  If it's long term self improvement and growth you're after... you have to do some serious thinking. 
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