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Author Topic: picking a pro-am pro... what matters?  (Read 6406 times)
elisedance
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ee


« Reply #60 on: April 26, 2010, 10:26:59 AM »

Anyone know of Nicoli Philipenchuck and his parents Igor and Polina Philipenchuck?

Emerallddancer here dances (and helps) at their studio!  PM her directly ...
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If you must leave the house, go build a home...

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elisedance
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ee


« Reply #61 on: April 26, 2010, 10:27:40 AM »

oops MC already posted that - must be an echo Roll Eyes
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If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
MusicChica
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Posts: 1325


« Reply #62 on: April 26, 2010, 11:00:45 AM »

Not to mention making the whole thing thoroughly enjoyable Cheesy  So many women spend a fortune to dance with a miserable parasite.  Yes, i do mean that I have seen pros that abuse, cheat and humiliate.  I suppose there may be a limited market for that Shocked but in most cases the clients seem to get sucked in and can't get out - rather like an abusive partnership...

Not disputing that. I never had it that bad but I heard of 2 women being hit by a Pro that I had but before my time.  My 2nd one actually.  A few people told me that story so I am assuming it is not false.

He was not nice to me.  I saw a Pro get nasty right on the floor of a comp and the same one count with his fingers in her eyes on the floor of a comp (he would be so fired).

My question is if the Pro is not the owner of the studio why not ask to change Pros? Is that not possible



There are shades of this.  There are the outright abusive pros (which is just soooooooo wrong, thankfully we don't have any of those at my studio), but there are also ones that are more subtle, and those, IMO, are even more damaging because it's not so outrightly obvious that you need to run, not walk, away from them.  These are the pros that you can never please, nothing you do is ever good enough.  The pros that push you to tears--and not just because there's a big event coming up and you're stressed.  And then there are the pros that are even more subtle than that, the ones that aren't really invested in doing Pro-Am and are just doing it for the money.  You can usually tell these pros by the lack of expression or emotion in their dancing and the pasted-on smile look on their face.  A student may not be consciously dissatisfied with either of these types of pros, but they might get some kind of nagging on their subconscious that something's not quite right, but they can't put their finger on just what it is, and eventually it will affect their dance experience.

I spent way too long with pros like the last 2 types, so I notice it more now.
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cornutt
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« Reply #63 on: April 26, 2010, 12:07:41 PM »

Not to mention making the whole thing thoroughly enjoyable Cheesy  So many women spend a fortune to dance with a miserable parasite.  Yes, i do mean that I have seen pros that abuse, cheat and humiliate.  I suppose there may be a limited market for that Shocked but in most cases the clients seem to get sucked in and can't get out - rather like an abusive partnership...

Could be the old sunk-cost fallacy at work too -- you put a bunch of money into a partnership, and then if you leave it, you feel like you've thrown all that money away. 

I knew a lady who put a bunch of money into a pro-am partnership.  The pro really didn't want to compete, but she talked him into it and I imagine the money spoke to him too.  It started OK; they won a couple of times in syllabus, but then the relationship got worse.  But she kept putting more money in because she thought it would get better with more lessons.  At the last comp they did, he showed up for a heat stone drunk.  I was there watching and I cringed when he led her out onto the floor.  He actually tried to pull himself together and they started OK, but about 20 seconds in, there was some issue with the music and they had to stop the heat and start over.  Well, that did it.  He completely lost it and she was understandably furious.  They danced poorly, and she left without even waiting to see if they would get a callback (of course they didn't).  She withdrew from the rest of the comp and that was the end of the partnership.
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elisedance
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ee


« Reply #64 on: April 26, 2010, 03:08:04 PM »

...which means the last comp was probably the best investment she made Undecided
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If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
dlgodud
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Posts: 773



« Reply #65 on: April 26, 2010, 04:39:57 PM »

Do you guys think that there are some Pros actually think that doing Pro-Am is kind of a shame for them? I had impressions from some of teachers I had and it wasn't pleasant at all.

One situation I had with my previous pro is:

Me: We all sponsor you right now.( I mentioned because he currently starts to compete himself with his new partner, and obviously his main source of income is from teaching and doing Pro-Am)

Teacher: Well, until I compete.

How shall I interpret his response?

What I was thinking at the moment was that he was not interested in teaching and competing with his students. I knew he wasn't even before we had this conversation. But, after having this conversation, I was kind of disappointed about his attitude about all this teaching and doing Pro-Am thing. I know it is a business on the other side, but couldn't not get rid of this feeling that I am just his paycheck.  Roll Eyes
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elisedance
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ee


« Reply #66 on: April 26, 2010, 07:06:02 PM »

If you feel that way - is probably true.  As discussed elsewhere, pro-am is always a bit of an uncomfortable mix of partner and paid dancer.  However much you both may try to be friends and equals as partners the underlying truth that without the payment it would not continue remains.

that said, it really does depends on the pro.  My last one (I just stopped pro-am in favor of AM - er, and of having a bank account Tongue ) managed to minimize the paid bit really well but I'm guessing that that is because I was his first schollarship student so there was some novelty to it for him as well as me.  I don't know what would happen in time if, say, he had 4 or 5 open dancers and had to ballance his energy between them and his very active competetive career. 
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If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
MrsMoose
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Posts: 271


« Reply #67 on: April 26, 2010, 11:21:47 PM »

Thanks EE will do it tomorrow most appreciated.

Nothing important, a friend in the area looking for beginner lessons maybe and asked me if I knew of it/them, wants to make sure she is choosing wisely.

She says I convinced her to go give it a whirl (punn intended)
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MusicChica
Intermediate Silver
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Posts: 1325


« Reply #68 on: April 27, 2010, 09:44:26 AM »

Thanks EE will do it tomorrow most appreciated.

Nothing important, a friend in the area looking for beginner lessons maybe and asked me if I knew of it/them, wants to make sure she is choosing wisely.

She says I convinced her to go give it a whirl (punn intended)


She's choosing very wisely when it comes to the Pilipenchuks! Smiley
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MrsMoose
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Posts: 271


« Reply #69 on: April 27, 2010, 10:14:13 AM »

thank you. I will take your word and not bother EmeraldD especially if my friend changes her mind about the whole thing.

Most appreciated.
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phoenix13
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Posts: 3359



« Reply #70 on: May 26, 2013, 09:12:49 AM »

If you feel that way - is probably true.  As discussed elsewhere, pro-am is always a bit of an uncomfortable mix of partner and paid dancer.  However much you both may try to be friends and equals as partners the underlying truth that without the payment it would not continue remains.

that said, it really does depends on the pro.  My last one (I just stopped pro-am in favor of AM - er, and of having a bank account Tongue ) managed to minimize the paid bit really well but I'm guessing that that is because I was his first schollarship student so there was some novelty to it for him as well as me.  I don't know what would happen in time if, say, he had 4 or 5 open dancers and had to ballance his energy between them and his very active competetive career. 

#1 for me -- a pro who wants to/enjoys dancing pro-am.   I'm doing this until[blah] or as a back-up plan is pro-am death, IMHO.  The teacher's gotta want to be there. 
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Dona nobis pacem.
elisedance
Administrator
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Posts: 35006


ee


« Reply #71 on: May 26, 2013, 06:38:21 PM »

If you feel that way - is probably true. As discussed elsewhere, pro-am is always a bit of an uncomfortable mix of partner and paid dancer.  However much you both may try to be friends and equals as partners the underlying truth that without the payment it would not continue remains.

that said, it really does depends on the pro.  My last one (I just stopped pro-am in favor of AM - er, and of having a bank account Tongue ) managed to minimize the paid bit really well but I'm guessing that that is because I was his first schollarship student so there was some novelty to it for him as well as me.  I don't know what would happen in time if, say, he had 4 or 5 open dancers and had to ballance his energy between them and his very active competetive career. 

#1 for me -- a pro who wants to/enjoys dancing pro-am.   I'm doing this until[blah] or as a back-up plan is pro-am death, IMHO.  The teacher's gotta want to be there. 
absolutely.  I even asked DP if he liked dancing with me at my last lesson.  He does <3
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If you must leave the house, go build a home...

The limit of your love is also the limit of your art...
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